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Electronic Real Estate Recording Task ForceMEETING MINUTES Minutes: 17 August 2000 Recorded by Robert Horton Present: (Members) David Arbeit, Jeanine Barker, Lynn Bluege-Rust, Carmen Bramante, Ann Burkhart, Angela Burrs, Jeff Carlson, David Claypool, Susan Dioury, Steve Fillbrandt (for Sen. Steve Kelley), Tiffany Heben, Marty Henschel, Robert Horton, Charles Hoyum, Charles Jensch, Mary Kiffmeyer, Paul Kiltinen, Cindy Koosman, Denny Kron, Paul McGinley, Mark Monacelli, Bill Mori, Chuck Parsons, Leonard Peterson, John Povejsil, Eileen Roberts, Dennis Unger, Joseph Witt. (Guests) Bill Batcher, Randy Becker, Bert Black, Luci Botzek, Gary Chadwick, Kevin Corbett, Mike McCarthy, Tab Pierce, Erland Rood, Lisa Skipton, Secretary of State Mary Kiffmeyer called the meeting to order at 9:00 AM. 1. Introduction of appointed members Secretary Kiffmeyer welcomed the task force and guests. All those present introduced themselves. 2. Minutes Secretary Kiffmeyer introduced Robert Horton, State Archivist, as the task force’s recorder. She explained how minutes were prepared, reviewed by her office, posted at the task force web site and e-mailed to members and interested parties. Chuck Parsons noted that Richard Little’s title on the list of members should be "Hennepin County Deputy Examiner of Titles." The minutes of the 17 July 2000 meeting were approved as distributed. 3. Review of the law establishing the task force Secretary Kiffmeyer said copies of the law establishing the task force were available for review. She and her staff would be happy to address any questions about it. 4. Review of open appointment application process Bert Black described the open appointment process. The law establishing the task force required the appointment of representatives from specific professions and offices; all those named in the law were represented. To insure that the task force was broadly inclusive, other appointments were being considered. He said that some information about members would be a matter of public record. 5. Workplan to be submitted to the legislature on or before 15 January 2001 Secretary Kiffmeyer said that the first goal of the task force was to prepare a workplan and a budget. Cindy Koosman said that a vice chair could share the burden of the work. She nominated Mark Monacelli for the position. There being no objection, the motion was unanimously approved. The workplan would cover what needed to be done during 2001-2003 and would detail the necessary resources to support the task force. 6. Sample workplans of other jurisdictions Bert Black reported that efforts to get sample workplans from other states had been so far unsuccessful. Mark Monacelli volunteered to report on what was being done on the national level; Bob Horton will contact Virginia for information; and Tiffany Heben will contact the counties in California which were studying the issues. Chuck Parsons asked if any jurisdictions had implemented electronic real estate recording. Carmen Bramante answered that 22 states have passed the Uniform Electronic Transactions Act (UETA), but that only a few had specifically amended laws pertinent to recording. He mentioned Arizona, Arkansas, California, Missouri and Utah. Texas and Virginia were formally examining electronic real estate recording. 7. Report on potential pre-emption (federal E-Sign legislation) In response to the questions about E-Sign raised at the 17 July meeting, Michael Cunniff asked the Hennepin County attorney’s office for an opinion. Bert Black will forward the response when it is received. Both Bert Black and Carmen Bramante noted that many people and jurisdictions were interested in the implications of E-Sign. No one is completely sure what 1 October will bring. John Povejsil asked if the Department of Justice had studied the matter. Bert Black will check and report back. 8. Secure digital signature demonstration Mike McCarthy, from the Office of the Secretary of State, and Tab Pierce, of ID Certify, gave an explanation and demonstration of digital signature technology. Secretary Kiffmeyer noted that different transactions demand different levels of security; this technology is appropriate for high level, high value transactions. Her office has not determined yet if it would go beyond its specific statutory role and become involved in types of electronic signatures appropriate for other types of transactions. She added that at the recent digital signature summit the general recommendation was to avoid talking in terms of specific technologies and to focus on root issues, such as identification, proof of identify and authority. Carmen Bramante said that both parties to a transaction must agree to use a specific technology and that the binding effect is proven by the documentation exchanged and approved before the transaction. Chuck Parsons noted that the effects of real estate transactions extend beyond the two parties initially involved in a transaction; that needed to be addressed in considering the appropriate technologies. Marty Henschel asked how many certificate authorities had been approved in Minnesota. Secretary Kiffmeyer said that none has been approved in Minnesota, but that reciprocal privileges have been extended to authorities recognized in the states of Washington and Utah. Chuck Parsons noted that many individuals will have little need for a signature card as described in the presentation. It might be more practical to license an entity to act, or sign, for someone. Carmen Bramante described the different approaches taken in Utah and Florida. First, in either state, the buyer/borrower has to agree to use the technology. Then, in Utah, a title company can issue a certificate for one-time use. Afterwards, an in-house notary will use a digital signature to wrap the entire documentation before submission. In Florida, the buyer/borrower signs holographically. The signature is scanned, along with proof of identity, such as a driver’s license. A notary then digitally signs and wraps the documentation. An officer of the title company digitally signs and wraps the documentation as well before submission. Mark Monacelli said that any revisions to the digital signature statute should address acknowledgement and notaries. He distributed copies of an article from the July 200 issue of The Real Estate Record on the fundamental principles of acknowledgement. 9. Payment system options Bill Batcher gave a presentation on payment system options, which would have to be in place to enable electronic transactions. The Office of the Secretary of State will have six options in place: cash, check, credit card, subscriber accounts (both automated clearing house and pre-paid) and inter-agency payment. The last has particular potential to simplifying things by arranging for a single point of payment by the customer and then subsequent distribution of fees to the appropriate agencies. 10. Surveyor presentation David Claypool and Lisa Skipton reviewed the principles, procedures and terminology of surveying, with particular attention to the difference between describing and locating land. He noted the difference between GIS (geographic information system) and GPS (global positioning system). 11. Future meeting schedules and agendas These dates and times were set for future meetings:
Bert Black outlined goals and issues pertinent to electronic real estate recording listed at the October 1999 meeting of the informal task force. Goals:
The task force added to this list one item: workflow (redesigning and improving the recording process). Issues:
The task force added to this list two items: the effect on and implications for consumers; and the costs of having multiple registration systems. Mark Monacelli noted that the county recorders were taking a pro-active attitude to electronic real estate recording and that their association had raised the issue in a letter to Dean Barkley dated June 1999. He asked that the task force web site reflect this. Secretary Kiffmeyer said that the site would do so. In the discussion of the goals and issues, Secretary Kiffmeyer suggested the task force should outline in the next meetings the chapter titles that needed to be written in the final report to the legislature. For the September meeting, the focus would be on discussing and analyzing workplans from other jurisdictions. If possible, any materials gathered would be posted online and distributed electronically. Leonard Peterson asked if there were a list of the documents that would need to be digitized for electronic real estate recording. The consensus was that this list should be compiled. Secretary Kiffmeyer said her office will check to see if it can establish a listserv for the task force. In not, members and interested parties could send messages to Bert Black for forwarding. 12. Action points Workplans from other jurisdictions: Mark Monacelli volunteered to report on what was being done on the national level; Bob Horton will contact Virginia for information; Bert Black will contact Texas; and Tiffany Heben will contact the counties in California which were studying the issues. Any material received in a timely fashion before the next meeting will be posted on the task force web site and distributed to members. E-Sign pre-emption: Bert Black will check to see if the Department of Justice has studied the implications of this law and will report back to the task force. The meeting adjourned at 12:02.
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